@kingsleym1 That is a great question. Michael Ramsden has an article entitled “Where is the Love?” that addresses this issue. He points out that love is meaningless if it does not pass accurate moral judgment. For example, if we love our children we teach them how to behave appropriately in public so that they can live a prosperous life - Jordan Peterson calls this “being a merciful proxy of the real world to our children”. In the same way, if your friend loves her brother, she must reflect God’s true moral judgment to him so that he can prosper eternally - it would be unloving to do otherwise.
I also included a Connect thread on how something can be wrong even if it isn’t hurting anyone that I hope you would find useful. The Lord grant you wisdom as you share His grace and truth
The words “I love you” mean something when the person who utters them knows exactly what you’re like and still cares for you. Love does not exist in the absence of judgment; true love exists when someone has passed the correct moral judgment on who you are and is under no illusions as to what you’re like, but still loves you.
The gospel is about the God who sees the situation we are in and passes judgment on it. He sees the pain. He passes judgment on our sin and shame, and yet, He so loves us and has compassion on us that He came into this world to be broken for us, so that we can know wholeness in Him. In Him, we find true freedom, love, and grace, and the ability to love others as He has so loved us.
Hi the first thing I will suggest is pray for your brother. The scripture is very clear about this, I will suggest if she really care about his brother have a conversation with Him and offer to Him her unconditional love but with the courage to confront the true what is founded in the Billie .
About the Sister first, she will need get to know God first, have relationship with Him, not an obligation to please any one, when she find His True she will be able to help her brother with God’s word. 1 Corinthians 13 describe what love is ; and what is impossible for us is possible with God. Ask God how to talk with your brother with God’s perspective . We can not help any one if we still in the process to understand and embrace His love and rest in his peace . If Your are honest with yourself and see you can not , yet help your brother, just pray for Him , give to the Lord and will lead you.
Hi, @kingsleym1! Maybe this was a part of your conversation, but I usually find it helpful to ask more specifically what it is that they imagine Christianity is not ‘agreeing’ with on this topic. I find that many people are working under the assumption that Christianity harbours some extremely intense hatred for gay people. There have been a number of threads on this topic, so I would suggest you browse them for some interesting arguments and thoughts.
It also sounds like they would be working under the assumption that to live and let live = loving, and challenging personal autonomy = ‘sin’. I love that @SeanO posted that Michael Ramsden article, which does remind us that true love cannot be separated from judgement (or even discernment). We do not ultimately condemn anyone; God is the only one who does that. But we are given the tools and are told to discern (as best we can) what is right and wrong.
I’ve had a similar discussion with a coworker of mine. She had told me that a cousin of her’s that she loves very much had just recently told his whole family that he cannot believe what the pope had said regarding gay priests should leave the ministry.
He apparently was highly offended by that and sent all his family members an ultimatum on choosing their religion or his lifestyle.
Much of her family is catholic but she used to go to a christian church. So I’ve been kinda witnessing to her and then she dropped this on me. She asked if my church accepted gays. And secondly, how she should respond to her cousin cause she’s not ready to give up on either (her religion or her cousin)
So i’m kinda in a similar situation and this seems to be a very rapidly increasing challenge that the Church worldwide is facing at a growing rate.
I actually read the article of the pope’s words and was actually impressed by his stance.
It seems that much of the world and media are so hoping for a ultra liberal pope who will except homosexuality and all its forms. The pressure has begun on all faiths.
I have yet to read all the other helpful threads. Let’s keep sharpening each other and loving the world just not their ways.