Nadia Bolz-webber shameless


(Kelvin Bottle) #1

Nadia has released a news book called shameless challenging the current status quo of our sexual ethics.

The following article by the TGC is excellent giving a good overview and the problem being faced.

In researching her and looking at the many comments many people are blinded and are thinking that she is right that it is acceptable.

What I have noticed is that they are so strong in the opinion that a gentle and gracious response is shot down quickly by those who have tried.

Biblical authority is not relevant onlying seeing some of scripture as authoritive. This of course is faulty logic in that if some is rejected then all is rejected.

Jesus is no longer saviour but merely a good moral teacher and as such his sacrifice is a waste.

Then we come to defining who is God

They see all of these differently.

So my question is this if the gentle approach is ineffective is it ever right to take a stronger more forceful approach and to call them out for believing a lie and to being misguided at the risk of being labelled intolerant or other?


(SeanO) #2

@Kelvin77 I really never understand people who preach self-indulgence in the name of a Savior who never married, never had sex, eschewed comfort, refused an earthly kingdom and took up a cross in order to demonstrate the love of God. In addition, the Sermon on the Mount is the most radically self-control oriented, self-sacrificial ethic in the world and Jesus makes it clear that not only is the OT sexual ethic correct, but that the righteousness God desires goes beyond our actions and to the level of our thought life.

Matthew 5:27-28 - “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28 But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

My first question would be: What do you mean by a more forceful approach? Are you suggesting being more direct in teaching God’s people truth in this area or in rebuking those who are teaching false doctrine? If the latter, what do you think is a wise way to rebuke someone who has already demonstrated by their actions and teachings that they not only disagree with the Biblical position, but actually flaunt sin in the face of it?


(Kelvin Bottle) #3

Option one to look at the teaching aspect of reaching people. When I have read and researchd the type of things others have said rebuking is not working in the sense that they are saying who are you to judge me.

Teaching is a better way forward however again it has its limitations in that if they have already made their minds up then again teaching is not going to make a difference. Again if you challenge the point of wrong and right then the response is who as you to tell me what truth is.

Logic: it’s not me setting what truth or sin is that’s the Bible informing us.

However if biblical authority has been undermined because they don’t see it as authoritive.

In which case would it not be a case of deconstructing their logic and placing doubt in what they currently believe before rebuilding?


(SeanO) #4

@Kelvin77 That is an interesting thought - there are 2 things that come to mind as we are processing this:

1 - Timing is important - sometimes it is just not the write time to speak into someone’s life because they are not prepared to hear the truth
2 - Asking good questions - perhaps you could make a list of good thought provoking questions that would not cause offense but may cause them to ponder their beliefs?

I know some folks like Wilberforce would actually make a list of topics to raise and questions that could naturally lead to them before having dinner guests. That way, they could attempt to turn the conversation toward the things of God, but they also did not force it. They attempted to plant the seeds for a deep, meaningful conversation but then allowed the conversation to play out in a natural way.