Rebirth and Astrology - Hindu worldview

Hi everyone,

The above subject is in direct contradiction to the Christian Worldview. I.e how does one explain the ability of a child/ person to remember in complete detail people’ name, places, texts and events with accurate details, but never having been present during that time. Which means stuff that happened during a different period

Second how does astrology have such an uncanny ability to determine a persons physical characteristic, his emotional and spiritual state of mind, their extended families and on some occasions also the ability to predict events in their lives in the future

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Hi Savio,
This is an important topic, and an interesting study of people.
I want to make sure I understand your first subject. Would you mind supplying an example of " ability of a child/ person to remember in complete detail people’ name, places, texts and events with accurate details, but never having been present during that time. Which means stuff that happened during a different period" ?

On your second topic of astrology, we run a risk of predetermined bias. By this I mean, we observe things and give it more credit or value than is actual. There is no science or foundation behind astrology. What is the mechanism for which astrology is predicted? I grew up around family members who are/were into astrology, so I observed the discussions, the predictions, charts, what have you…

We can observe the patterns of the stars as they appear and rely on their appearance at certain times in certain parts of the sky. We’ve given them names and studied them. Astrology thrusts value or control of the inanimate (stars) on the living. It does it in such a vague way that it can be assessed as accurate. I just went to the free horoscope site to see what’s on for today, and I’m amazed at how generic it is. I could pretty much say those things to anyone and it could be molded into an experience. It’s kind of like being amazed by a magician.

I think it’s human nature to want to know what’s going to happen, and we seek ways to understand the stresses and uncertainties of the days. We crave a place to be grounded because free floating in space is unpleasant. We often search for moorings apart from God. As Christians we are called to filter differently when we observe the days through a biblical perspective and operate in obedience to and trust of Christ. Humans are such complex beings with individual and corporate qualities that make the world an amazing place.
There is so much to say on these topics. I look forward to hearing what others have to say.

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Hi everyone,

I’m not sure if I understood well the subject…
As a christian I’ve never been a believer in astrology and the predictions but after my experience I’ve opened my mind.
My best friend is not christian. She always shares with me about various types of alternative therapies she is studying, and as a friend I’m used to listen to her experiences and studies about astrology.
One day she asked for my permission to see my birth chart. I confess I was pretty sceptic of it but after this experience I changed my opinion. I’ve changed not to follow the astrology concepts and predictions, but to open my mind and realise that could be a tool to understand more who I am, my tendencies and increasing my level of awareness.
The birth chart is not rule for your life or to be used to victimize or labelling people, it’s just an alternative tool to understand more about your behaviours and tendencies. It’s like your first configuration of birth.
Fortunately, people are continuously changing and growing with their experiences in life and self-knowledge. What I mean is that our behaviours and opinions are continuously changing when we understand more about ourselves.

@monteiro_savio, good questions! I have been asked these questions previously and I dont think the evidence for rebirth or astrology is as convincing as is claimed to be.

Past-life recalls by children
Past-life recall is ofen presented by reincarnationists as proof for their philosophy. As far as I know it is based on the works of hypnosis by Dr. Brian Weiss and children’s spontaneous recall of events by Dr. Ian Stevenson. I am curious if there is more recent information on past-life recall. Most of the evidence cited is anecdotal. Here are some criticisms that I have come across regarding their findings and methodology-

  • Hypnosis involves inducing an altered state of consciousness where a person is in a higly suggestive state and can easily mix real with fictitious memories. Many a times patients assume a different personality, a changed voice and behavior. One possible explanation is something called “Cryptoamnesia” where things that are not in conscious memory are brought to surface in hypnosis by mere exposure to particular information in the past and is applied to a new scenario in hypnosis. Another anomaly is that these past life recalls were culturally or religiously conditioned based on the background of the individual.
  • One possibility that cannot be ruled out in an altered state of consciousness is that the person is being subjected to influence from other spirits i.e channeling. That’s a distinct possibility considering the change in voice and personality in many of the cases. Ian Stevenson admits in his writings of instances of ‘possessing influences’ in some cases where the same person exhibited two different personalities.
  • Interestingly, all of the cases of children studied were from countries where reincarnation is the prevailing view. Ian Stevenson’s work had no external unbiased interpreters to confirm the findings.
  • There was also no direct relationship between morality of the previous life and the alleged reincarnated life in Stevenson’s work.

You will find a more detailed response on this question here.

Astrology
Again, I have had to deal much with this in my family. There was nothing done in my family that I grew up in, without considering the position of stars. Astrology was so built into my family traditions- whether it was naming a baby, the first time a baby ate food, the day chosen to move into a new home, choosing a suitable life partner, the day chosen for a wedding, for a job, for a religious ceremony etc. Its often touted as a scientific practice but does science really support it? Dr. Hugh Ross 's responses suggest otherwise. Any scientific phenomenon will be based on regularity and will have high predictability but that is not the case with astrology. A simple argument I have come across is - Why twins born at the same time are so different in personality despite similar positions of planets at their time of birth? A few of the scientific objections that Dr. Ross raises are here-

Astrology

. bases horoscopes on the moment of birth, not the moment of
conception when, in fact, ones genetic characteristics are
fixed;

. ignores the gravitational forces of non-solar system bodies
(e.g. the pull of gravity by the obstetrician upon a newborn
child is about six times greater than that of Mars);

. treats the various nuclear, magnetic, and gravitational forces
exerted by solar system bodies (e.g. the sun, planets, moons,
asteroids, comets, etc.) as if they were of the same magnitude.
In reality, differences of many orders of magnitude were long
ago verified by research;

. ignores significant solar system bodies, e.g. Uranus, Neptune,
Pluto, asteroids, comets, etc.;

. fails to take into account tidal forces, also gravitational
differences resulting from the irregular shape of some solar
system bodies;

. ignores the motion of the Sun with respect to other stars and
with respect to the center of the galaxy;

. fails to provide conclusive evidence of a direct causal link
between celestial positions or RaspectsS and human personality
and interactions.

So why does astrology seem to work sometimes? If it’s not scientifically explained, if it’s opposed by the Bible, there is only one other source to consider- false spirits. False spirits can be partially right but only God can be always right. The Bible pronounces pretty strong judgment for astrolgers!

All the counsel you have received has only worn you out! Let your astrologers come forward, those stargazers who make predictions month by month, let them save you from what is coming upon you. Surely they are like stubble; the fire will burn them up . . . Isaiah 47:13-14

Another possible argument I have heard is, the devil always takes what is true and twists it and perhaps God created the planets to influence our personalities. Didn’t the magi follow a star to visit Jesus at the time of His birth? I tend to think that the event of the birth of Jesus, was just another way we see the fulfillment of heavens declaring the glory of God and pointing men to its Maker.

Ps 19:1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament shows his handywork.

The heavens which were meant to direct our attention to God according to the Bible, has been turned around in Astrology to direct attention to self. That to me look like the fingerprints of the enemy of God. God on the other hand seeks for us to not just better ourselves by our strength but by His Spirit.

2 Cor 3:18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit.

When we choose a way not authorized by the Bible as a Christian for our growth, I think we just make it harder for ourselves to be led by God’s Spirit. I too have dabbled in horoscopes in the past unknowingly for fun but on seeing its connection with the occult I have chosen to walk away from it.

There is a lot more that could be said but I think I should stop here for now. A book called “Reincarnation, a Christian Appraisal - Mark Albrecht” also addressed the past life recall studies. May God guide you as you look into these answers and witness for Christ.

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Hi April,

Thank you for your reply and views. Much appreciated.

I will try and get you published reports on rebirth and our inability to answer them. You will find very limited mention of such incidences in the west. You could also perhaps read a lovely book on the subject “ many lives many masters by Dr Brian Weiss”

On astrology I do not refer to the Sunday times or Linda Goodman’s astrology. Hindu astrology has been in existence for over 5000 yrs and a lot of information on the exact and precise methods used to arrive at the calculations are recorded and available. There are schools and Scholars who currently impart this knowledge not only to Indians but to a lot of westerners as well. Do also remember that astrology goes as far back as to the birth of christ. The three wise men from the east just didn’t follow a star. That was a metaphor. Their astrological calculations lead them to predict that a one in a life time divine event was going to take place. The son of God would be born to a virgin and they came to pay their respects

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Hi Lakshmi,

Wow!! You do know and understand both sides of the divide. While a strong Christian I don’t think my faith is as deep and profound as it should be and hence these questions.

I will ponder and re read your text.

Pray for me

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@monteiro_savio, Thanks! It’s been a while since I read the books on past life recall and I hope the information will be helpful to you. I was given the book by Brian Weiss about twenty years ago, when I had just broken the news of my Christian faith to my Hindu family. I have to update myself with more recent books in this area. I really trust Dr. Hugh Ross reply on astrology and its connection with the occult. In another video I had seen, Dr. Ross shared an experience of manifestation of spirits due to an astrological chart left in a house by a previous owner (shares it at 12 min).

I am so glad you are asking the questions and it doesn’t mean a weakness in faith. It takes time to find answers and we all learn from each other. Will be praying. May God fill you with the knowledge of His will and lead you by His Spirit as you search for these answers.

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Hi Savio,
I apologize for the delay in replying. I’ve had a challenging week, and Connect discussions didn’t happen.
It’s very interesting that you bring up the wise men. We know that they were educated, scholarly and wealthy. I have observed many things in the Bible that suggest the experience of the wise men (magi) was not a metaphor.

The references to the star in the Bible make this star exceedingly unique and demonstrates that God wanted to use things familiar (studied) by the men to bring them into knowledge of Himself. My Amplified Bible (which takes the Hebrew and Greek and draws out the meaning more fully) says this:
" After hearing the king, they went their way; and behold, the star, which they had seen in the east, went on before them [continually leading the way] until it came and stood over the place where the young Child was. When they saw the star, they rejoiced exceedingly with great joy." Matthew 2:9-10.

We can assume the wise men of Jesus’s time had greater knowledge than just a significant divine event because they knew Jesus’s lineage and culture, “Where is he who has been born king of the Jews? For we saw his star at its rising and have come to worship him.” (Matthew 2:2)

They most likely had access to information made available from the time that Daniel (writer of the Book of Daniel) was a Jew in captivity (around 605-535 BC). Even though Daniel was a captive, he was a highly regarded member among the king’s wise men/magi for a period of about 70 years during the time of Babylon, Medes and Persia. Though he worked among nations that worshiped anything other than the Living God, Daniel makes it clear throughout his life that his wisdom and knowledge comes from God only, and was willing to die for what he knew to be true on several occasions.

Throughout time God has made information about Himself in Christ available. And since He has full knowledge of all time, He is able to orchestrate the events of now to benefit the events of the future.

In 1 Samuel 5 God takes a false god, an idol made of stone that had been worshiped, and humbles it before the Philistines repeatedly to make it clear that there is no other God.

In Luke 19:39-40 we read : "Some of the Pharisees from the crowd told him, “Teacher, rebuke your disciples.”
He (Jesus) answered, “I tell you, if they were to keep silent, the stones would cry out.”

We have a compassionate and gracious God Who will come alongside to help us understand Who He is and that our salvation is in Him alone. The more I study the Bible the more I’m amazed at His gracious workings with mankind in a way that is always faithful to His character and holiness.

If you are interested in some Bible study with lots of value, I would recommend Bible Study Fellowship which offers classes for men, women and children worldwide. You might have a class near you.

Again thank you for bringing up such a interesting topic! May your week be blessed with refreshment and peace in the Person of Jesus Christ!

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