Should apologetics discuss cosmology?

(Patrick Follin) #1

Should Apologetics cover/discuss biblical cosmology and creationism?

(Josephine Dearsley) #2

Hi brother,
I don’t think I’m the person to answer this question, but if you want to have a look at some scientific facts behind creation and all that I suggest you look up the John Ankerberg Show. He has lots if interviews with different apologists and scientists and it’s very interesting. Take a look at his series: the top scientific facts that prove God exists and the series discussing Darwinism…
Hope that helps in some way…

(SeanO) #3

@Sabrewulf Some apologists actually construct a case for Christiantiy based on cosmology. William Lane Craig has even developed what he calls the ‘Kalam Cosmological Argument’ for God’s existence based on cosmology.

You may also be interested in checking out Reasons to Believe.

Here are a few threads you may find interesting regarding the age of the earth.

The Lord Jesus grant you wisdom and understanding as you study.

I am curious along with @omnarchy, what brought up this question?

(Omar Rushlive Lozada Arellano) #4

Hello @Sabrewulf. It should. It’s one of the topics which apologetics addresses. Do you have a specific reason why you asked this question regarding cosmology and creationism?

(Patrick Follin) #5

I believe it’s an essential and a vital question that should be address in Apologetics because of the atheistic and secular conception of Heliocentricism vs
geocentricism cosmology. That not only goes against biblical cosmology but against all ancient civilizations depictions. Darwinism aids the big bang etc. One theory props up another. Seemingly until five centuries ago everyone agreed the earth was the center of the universe and was stationary and flat.
I ask because since Apologetics teaches and lectures in many Ivy league and prestigious schools. Therefore I wonder because this being a conflict of interest with what they teach. I think it’s a crucial point in proving the bible, the Genesis account and how most of our forefathers are not only atheist but are also Kabbalist and dabbled in to occultic practices. Thank you!!

(Patrick Follin) #6

Thank you, will do.

(SeanO) #7

@Sabrewulf Are you suggesting that the Bible supports geocentrism? I cannot tell from your statement. The below Christian organizations are clear that heliocentrism is Biblical and they are Bible believing. I think it is possible to believe the Bible and to believe in an old earth and even evolution, assuming that humans were a singularity where God stepped in and did something supernatural. I do not believe in macro-evolution because I believe the scientific evidence is lacking and that God created every creature after its own ‘kind’.

“We also believe that acceptance of, say, non-geocentric astronomy is consistent with full submission to Biblical authority.”

" In the middle ages and well into the Renaissance, the Roman Catholic Church did teach geocentrism, but was that based upon the Bible? The Church’s response to Galileo (1564–1642) was primarily from the works of Aristotle (384–322 BC) and other ancient Greek philosophers. It was Augustine (AD 354–430), Thomas Aquinas (1224–1274) and others who ‘baptized’ the work of these pagans and termed them ‘pre-Christian Christians’. This mingling of pagan science and the Bible was a fundamental error for which the Church eventually paid a tremendous price.

Confusion persists to today in that nearly every textbook that discusses the Galileo affair claims that it was a matter of religion vs science, when it actually was a matter of science vs science. Unfortunately, Church leaders interpreted certain Biblical passages as geocentric to bolster the argument for what science of the day was claiming. This mistake is identical to those today who interpret the Bible to support things such as the big bang, billions of years, or biological evolution.11 Therefore, any evangelical Christian misinformed of this history who opines that the Bible is geocentric is hardly any more credible a source on this topic than an atheist or agnostic."

" Taken in order, Genesis 1:14-18, Psalm 104:5, Job 26:7 and Isaiah 40:22 were often cited to support the geocentric theory of Ptolemaeus. Yet none of these Scriptures, taken in any order whatsoever, state that God designed the universe with Earth at its center. In fact, Earth isn’t even the center of its own small solar system; the sun is. We can understand why Copernicus and, later, Galileo, who posited the sun-centered (heliocentric) theory, caused such a controversy in the church. It was thought that heliocentricism contradicted the biblical teaching of geocentrism. But, again, the problem was that God’s Word doesn’t say that the Earth is at the center of anything. Sadly, as time went on and people came to understand that the Earth did in fact revolve around the Sun, many simply lost faith in God’s Word, because they had falsely been taught geocentrism."

(Patrick Follin) #8

I know my history, the presented historical facts. I know the bible doesn’t specifically teach a geocentric earth and I also realize who and when it was changed. Copernicus amongst others were not only kabbalist but we’re also Sun Worshipers. Which hence at the Heliocentric conception and its orgins, not to metion it’s roots the i.e. Catholic Church.
Now as for the last claim: “We know the Earth in fact revolves around the Sun” There still isn’t any proof to date of this hypothesis or claim. Thousands of years worth of constellations lining up year after year would seemingly beg to differ, definitely shoots holes in the theory. Are you willing to digest the possibility that the bible amongst many ancient books is a Flatearth book? Genesis 1-14 Let there be light “IN” the firmament. Genesis gives us a perfect description of our world. Exercise: sit down and draw the descriptions given throughout the bible. I bet no one will draw a round rotating earth.

(SeanO) #9

@Sabrewulf I appreciate those thoughts. There is in fact scientific evidence that the earth orbits the sun, but I agree that a the natural assumption would be that the earth is fixed because we do not feel like the earth is moving. Our experience of the earth is from the vantage point of someone living upon it and we cannot detect its motion. That is why it took humans a few thousand years to reach the conclusion that the earth revolves around the sun in a verifiable way.

Regarding Scripture, the Biblical authors do not support either theory directly in my opinion. Rather, they speak using the frame of reference that they had in their particular time / place in history. Their goal was not to debate whether or not the earth rotates around the sun, but rather to convey a message about God as Creator and Sustainer of all things, including the cosmos.

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